formal pronoun: Jesus addressing his disciples and common people

Like many languages (but unlike Greek or Hebrew or English), Tuvan uses a formal vs. informal 2nd person pronoun (a familiar vs. a respectful “you”). Unlike other languages that have this feature, however, the translators of the Tuvan Bible have attempted to be very consistent in using the different forms of address in every case a 2nd person pronoun has to be used in the translation of the biblical text.

As Voinov shows in Pronominal Theology in Translating the Gospels (in: The Bible Translator 2002, p. 210ff. ), the choice to use either of the pronouns many times involved theological judgment. While the formal pronoun can signal personal distance or a social/power distance between the speaker and addressee, the informal pronoun can indicate familiarity or social/power equality between speaker and addressee.

Here, Jesus is addressing his disciples, individuals and/or crowds with the formal pronoun, showing respect.

In most Dutch translations, Jesus addresses his disciples and common people with the informal pronoun, whereas they address him with the formal form.

formal 2nd person plural pronoun (Japanese)

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Like a number of other East Asian languages, Japanese uses a complex system of honorifics, i.e. a system where a number of different levels of politeness are expressed in language via words, word forms or grammatical constructs. These can range from addressing someone or referring to someone with contempt (very informal) to expressing the highest level of reference (as used in addressing or referring to God) or any number of levels in-between.

One way Japanese shows different degree of politeness is through the choice of a formal plural suffix to the second person pronoun (“you” and its various forms) as shown here in the widely-used Japanese Shinkaiyaku (新改訳) Bible of 2017. In these verses, anata-gata (あなたがた) is used, combining the second person pronoun anata and the plural suffix -gata to create a formal plural pronoun (“you” [plural] in English).

(Source: S. E. Doi, see also S. E. Doi in Journal of Translation, 18/2022, p. 37ff. )

Honorary "are" construct denoting God (“say”)

Click or tap here to see the rest of this insight.

Like a number of other East Asian languages, Japanese uses a complex system of honorifics, i.e. a system where a number of different levels of politeness are expressed in language via words, word forms or grammatical constructs. These can range from addressing someone or referring to someone with contempt (very informal) to expressing the highest level of reference (as used in addressing or referring to God) or any number of levels in-between.

One way Japanese shows different degree of politeness is through the usage of an honorific construction where the morpheme are (され) is affixed on the verb as shown here in the widely-used Japanese Shinkaiyaku (新改訳) Bible of 2017. This is particularly done with verbs that have God as the agent to show a deep sense of reverence. Here, iw-are-ru (言われる) or “say” is used.

(Source: S. E. Doi, see also S. E. Doi in Journal of Translation, 18/2022, p. 37ff. )

Translation commentary on Mark 9:1

Exegesis:

amēn (cf. 3.28) ‘truly,’ ‘solemnly.’

hoti ‘that’ is recitative, introducing direct speech.

eisin tines hōde tōn hestēkotōn ‘there are some of those standing here,’ ‘some of those here present.’

hōde (cf. 8.4) ‘here.’

hoi hestēkotes ‘those who are standing’: the verb histēmi ‘stand’ is used here in the sense of ‘being’ or ‘existing’ rather than the strictly physical sense of ‘standing’ (Lagrange ‘some of those present’; O Novo Testamento de Nosso Senhor Jesus Cristo. Revisdo Autorizada ‘some of those who are here’).

hoitines ou mē geusōntai thanatou ‘who certainly will not taste death,’ ‘who will by no means die’: the double negative is emphatic, and the statement is a forceful way of saying ‘who certainly will be alive.’

ou mē (9.41; 10.15; 13.2, 19, 30; 14.25, 31; 16.18) ‘not’: an emphatic way of making a negative statement.

geuomai (only here in Mark) ‘taste’: in a figurative sense, as here, ‘experience,’ ‘come to know.’

heōs an idōsin ‘until they see’: the meaning is not that they will die as soon as they see the Kingdom of God come with power; the emphasis is on the fact that during their lifetime they will see the Kingdom come with power.

heōs an (cf. 6.10) ‘until.’

eidein ‘see’: the word should be translated literally, rather than in a figurative manner, e.g. ‘perceive,’ ‘become aware of,’ ‘experience.’ The aorist subjunctive should be simply rendered ‘see’ rather than ‘have seen,’ as some translations have it.

tēn basileian tou theou elēluthuian en dunamei ‘the Kingdom of God having come with power’: the perfect passive participle elēluthuian ‘having come’ functions as an adjective (in the predicate position) which makes an additional statement concerning the Kingdom. It is not, simply, that in their lifetime they will see the Kingdom of God: it is that they will see the Kingdom present (‘having come’) in power. This ‘having come,’ therefore, lies in the future just as much as heōs an idōsin ‘until they see’: it is said that they will see (in the future, within their lifetime) the Kingdom having arrived – which ‘arrival’ is also future in relation to the time of the prediction. A translation should attempt accurately to convey the meaning of the Greek, which is reasonably clear and precise.

(On the interpretation of the passage, see the commentaries in loc.).

hē basileia tou theou (cf. 1.15) ‘the Reign of God’: here spoken of as an ‘event’ (however interpreted), visible in its coming.

elēluthuia ‘having come’: regardless of the interpretation of the verse, the force of the perfect participle should be observed. In Revised Standard Version ‘before they see the kingdom of God come,’ the ‘come’ is ambiguous: it may mean ‘having come,’ but may also mean ‘coming.’

Translation:

Them should refer to the same group as is identified in 8.34, ‘the crowd as well as the disciples.’

For this use of truly, with double type of attribution, see 8.12.

Some standing here, as an expression equivalent to ‘now living,’ may actually be translated in certain languages as ‘some sitting here,’ for ‘sitting’ is in a number of languages of Africa, for example, the verb which by extension also means ‘to live’ or ‘to exist.’

A literal translation of taste death has been understood in some languages to mean ‘partake of a cannibalistic meal.’ The meaning is, of course, ‘to die,’ though in some languages the negative is shifted to the subject constituent rather than to the verb, e.g. ‘not all those here are going to die until they see…’ (Copainalá Zoque). This shift is designed to avoid the tendency to interpret the ‘until’ clause as designating the point at which such persons are to die. In some languages, one can preserve something of the force of the idiom ‘taste death’ by using a parallel ‘feel death’ (Tabasco Chontal), ‘see death’ (Navajo; cf. also Toraja-Sa’dan), and ‘suffer death’ (Highland Puebla Nahuatl).

In some languages the expression ‘see the kingdom’ is impossible, because ‘kingdom’ actually identifies a process of ‘rule’ or ‘ruling’ (see kingdom, 1.15 and 4.11). However, one can often speak of ‘see God ruling,’ which would be the closest equivalent to see the kingdom of God. In other instances one may be able to translate as ‘see that God has now begun to rule with power,’ though this is not a very close approximate.

Power is generally rendered in this context as ‘great authority’ (Tzeltal), or ‘strength to command,’ rather than merely ‘power’ or ‘might,’ if these terms refer primarily to physical prowess or dominance.

It must be recognized that part of the difficulty of translating this verse is the fact that scholars are so divided as to what it actually means. In all fairness to the Scriptures it is best to avoid taking any overly decisive position, or the results may do violence, either to the prediction of Jesus or to the subsequent events of history.

Quoted with permission from Bratcher, Robert G. and Nida, Eugene A. A Handbook on the Gospel of Mark. (UBS Handbook Series). New York: UBS, 1961. For this and other handbooks for translators see here .