During the translation of one of the miracles of feeding or crowds with fish and bread into Yami, Graham Ogden tells this story:
“A small population on tiny Orchid Island, off the S-E coast of Taiwan, depended to a large extent on fishing as a source of food. When translating the story of the Five Loaves and Two Fish the translator asked a question that took me by surprise. He asked what kind of fish they were. I said they were just fish! But he said, I have to know what kind of fish they were because we have no word ‘fish.’ How come? I asked. He said we have no general word, because every fish has a name. So I suggested he choose a common type. He then said, But was it a fish that only men can eat or only women? Do you mean that there are cultural restrictions on who can eat which kind of fish? Yes, he said. Is there not one kind of fish that everyone can eat, given the circumstances? Oh yes, he said, there is one kind. Then that’s the name to use, I said. He was satisfied with that answer.”
1936 painting by Wang Suda 王肅達 (1910-1963),
Housed in the Société des Auxiliaires des Missions Collection – Whitworth University
(click image to enlarge)
Image taken from Chinese Christian Posters . For more information on the “Ars Sacra Pekinensis” school of art, see this article , for other artworks of that school in TIPs, see here.
Retrotraducciones en español (haga clic o pulse aquí)
Jesús y los discípulos fueron y entraron al barco y el barco zarpó a un lugar en el campo donde no había gente.
Todas las personas que veían a Jesús (decían): “Vamonos”, y caminaban al lugar rural y lo esperaban.
El barco estaba zarpando y Jesús veía (a la gente) alrededor y dijo en si mismo: ‘No hay otra persona para ayudarlos, estas personas que me están esperando son como ovejas sin pastor. ¿Quién ayuda y cuida a los ovejas?’
Jesús sentía compasión y cuando habían salido del barco Jesús empezó a enseñar por un tiempo largo.
Después los discípulos vinieron y dijeron: “Jesús, aquí ya es tarde y no hay nada de comer, mejor que tú les digas adios, y se vayan a donde haya pueblos y compren para la comida.”
Jesús (respondió): “Uds les repartan comida.”
Los discípulos dijeron: “Si nosotros vamos y compramos un montón de pan pagamos doscientas (monedas) de plata.” Jesús (dijo): “Mira allá, ¿cuánto pan hay?” Los discípulos miraban alrededor y dijeron: “Hay cinco panes y dos peces.”
Jesús (dijo): “Por favor, diles a las personas que se senten en el suelo, en las plantas verdes, en grupos”
Los discípulos llamaban a la gente que vinieran y se sentaban en grupos de 50 y grupos de 100, 50 aquí, 100 allí.
Cuando todo estaba en órden Jesús tomó los cinco panes y los dos peces y miró hacia arriba y dijo una bendición.
Tomó el pan, lo rompía en pedazos y los echaba en una canasta y cuando estaba llena una canasta la dio a los discípulos, y ellos la recibieron y repartían el pan a la gente.
Jesús tomó los peces, los cortaba en pedazos y los echaba en una canasta, y cuando estaba llena la dio a los discípulos y ellos la tomaron y repartían los peces a la gente.
¿Cuántos había? Cinco mil hombres y además mujeres y niños, todos juntos.
Los panes y los peces que sobraban, los discípulos los ponían en canastas hasta llenarlas y contaban doce canastas de sobras.
Jesus and the disciples went and got in a boat and the boat set sail to a rural place where there were no people.
All the people who saw Jesus (said): “Let’s go”, and they walked over to the rural place and waited for him to come.
The boat was sailing and Jesus looked around (at the people) and said to himself: ‘There is no-one else to help them, these people that are awaiting me are like sheep without a shepherd. Who will help and take care of the sheep?’
Jesus felt compassion and after they had got off the boat Jesus began to teach for a long time.
Afterwards the disciples came to him and said: “Jesus, it’s late here, and there is nothing to eat, it’s better you tell them goodbye and they go to where there are villages and buy something to eat.”
Jesus (responded): “You hand out food to them.”
The disciples said: “If we go and buy a heap of bread we will pay 200 silver (coins).” Jesus (said): “Look over there, how much bread is there?” The disciples looked around and said: “There are five loaves of bread and two fish.”
Jesus (said): “Please, tell the people that they sit down on the ground, in the green plants, in groups.”
The disciples called the people to come and they sat down in groups of 50 and groups of 100, 50 here, 100 there.
When everything was done, Jesus took the five loaves of bread and the two fish, looked up and said a blessing.
He took the bread, broke it in pieces and threw the pieces in a basket and when the basket was full he gave it to the disciples and they took it and handed out the bread to the people.
Jesus took the fish and cut them in pieces and threw them in a basket and when the basket was full he gave it to the disciples and they took it and handed out the fish to the people.
How many were there? Five thousand men plus women and children, all together.
The bread and the fish that was left over the disciples put in baskets that they filled up, and they counted twelve baskets of leftovers.
Jesus sent the disciples out two by two to preach in different places. When the disciples came back, they told stories. Some said:
— We taught a lot!
Others said:
— We cast out demons!
Others said:
— We healed the sick!
The disciples told all these things. Jesus listened to them and said:
— You haven’t even had time to eat. Let’s go to a deserted place and you can rest there for a while.
The disciples went and got on a boat and sailed away secretly so that no one would know. But as they sailed away, the people around them saw Jesus sailing there. The people began to call out to each other, and a great multitude gathered. And they waited for Jesus on the shore. The boat came to a place, and Jesus left the boat and saw a great multitude of people gathered around.
Jesus felt sorry for them. He said:
— You are like sheep without a shepherd! There is no one to take care of you. Without a shepherd the sheep wander, and so do you.
Jesus began to teach them. As Jesus taught and taught them, it was nearing evening. The disciples came to Jesus and said:
— It’s getting evening. Let’s let the people go home. There are some who live in the surrounding villages. Let them buy food for themselves there.
Jesus said:
— No, you must feed them all.
Disciples:
— How? Where are we going to get so much bread? There are many people here, it would take about 200 denarii. That’s a lot of bread it will take.
Jesus:
— See if anyone has some food.
The disciples began to look and found some bread and fish. They came up to Jesus and said:
— Here are five loaves and two fish.
Jesus told the people to all spread out in rows — 50 rows, with 100 people in each row. The disciples went and helped the people to sit in 50 rows. Jesus took the bread and two fish. He lifted his eyes to heaven and said:
— I thank God for this food. He broke the bread and began to pass it on to the disciples so that the disciples could pass it on to the people. He did the same with the fish — Jesus passed the fish to the disciples, and the disciples passed it to the people. All the people ate and were filled, there were even pieces of bread left over. There were about 5,000 people in all. They were all full. The disciples gathered the leftover bread. They collected one full basket, then another, then another, then another, then another, and in all they collected 12 full baskets.
Original Russian back-translation (click or tap here):
Иисус отправлял учеников по двое проповедовать по разным местам. Когда ученики возвращались, они рассказывали. Одни говорили:
— Мы много учили!
Другие говорили:
— Мы бесов изгоняли!
Третьи говорили:
— Мы больных исцеляли!
Ученики рассказывали все это. Иисус слушал их и сказал:
— У вас даже не было времени поесть. Давайте перейдем в безлюдное место, и вы можете там немного передохнуть.
Ученики пошли, сели на лодку и отплыли тайно, чтобы никто не знал. Но когда они отплыли, люди вокруг увидели, что там плывет Иисус. Люди стали звать друг друга, и собралось великое множество народа. И они ждали Иисуса на берегу. Лодка приплыла на место, Иисус покинул лодку и увидел множество людей, которые собрались вокруг.
Иисусу стало жаль их. Он сказал:
— Вы — словно овцы без пастуха! Нет никого, кто может позаботиться о них. Без пастуха овцы блуждают, так же и вы.
Иисус стал их учить. Иисус учил-учил их, время уже близилось к вечеру. Ученики подошли к Иисусу и сказали:
— Уже вечереет. Давай отпустим народ домой. Тут есть такие, которые живут в окрестных селениях. Пусть они там себе купят еды.
Иисус сказал:
— Нет, вы должны накормить их всех.
Ученики:
— Как? Где мы возьмем столько хлеба? Тут множество народа, нужно примерно 200 динариев. Очень много хлеба потребуется.
Иисус:
— Поищите, может быть, у кого-нибудь найдется немного еды.
Ученики начали искать и нашли немного хлеба и рыбы. Они подошли к Иисусу и сказали:
— Вот есть пять хлебов и две рыбины.
Иисус сказал людям, чтобы все расселись по рядам — 50 рядов, в каждом — по 100 человек. Ученики пошли и помогли людям рассесться по 50 рядов. Иисус взял хлеб и две рыбы. Поднял глаза к небу сказал:
— Благодарю Бога за эту еду. Преломил хлеб и начал передавать ученикам, чтобы ученики передавали дальше людям. Так же и с рыбой он делал — Иисус передавал рыбу ученикам, ученики передавали народу. Весь народ поел, насытился, и даже остались еще куски хлеба. Всего было около 5000 человек. Они все наелись. Ученики собрали остатки хлеба. Собрали одну полную корзину, потому вторую, третью, всего собрали полных 12 корзин.
Following are a number of back-translations of Mark 6:43:
Uma: “After they ate, they gathered up the leftover bread and fish, twelve baskets full.” (Source: Uma Back Translation)
Yakan: “After they had eaten, the disciples of Isa gathered their left-over bread and fish, twelve baskets full.” (Source: Yakan Back Translation)
Western Bukidnon Manobo: “And as for that food, his disciples picked up twelve baskets of broken bread and fish which were left over.” (Source: Western Bukidnon Manobo Back Translation)
Kankanaey: “When they gathered-up what was left-over, twelve baskets were filled (lit. placed-in) with the broken-scraps of food.” (Source: Kankanaey Back Translation)
Tagbanwa: “The disciples collected that left-over bread and fish which had been broken into pieces, and twelve baskets were filled.” (Source: Tagbanwa Back Translation)
In v. 43 instead of kophinōn plērōmata ‘basketfuls’ of all modern editions of the Greek text, Textus Receptus has kophinous plēreis ‘baskets full.’
Exegesis:
echortasthēsan (7.27; 8.4, 8) ‘they were fed,’ ‘they were filled,’ ‘they were satisfied.’
kai ēran klasmata dōdeka kophinōn plērōmata ‘and they took up (the) broken pieces, twelve basketfuls.’ While it is possible that the subject of ‘they took up’ is the disciples, it is more probable that the verb is used impersonally, meaning simply ‘twelve basketfuls were taken up.’
klasma (8.8, 19, 20) ‘fragment,’ ‘broken piece’: it should be made clear in translation that these were pieces that remained uneaten, not crumbs that were dropped in eating.
dōdeka kophinōn plērōmata literally ‘twelve fillings of baskets,’ ‘twelve basketfuls’: plērōma is ‘that which fills,’ ‘complement’ (cf. 2.21), and the phrase here indicates the amount (in terms of capacity) of broken pieces of bread which remained. The strict meaning is rather ‘twelve basketfuls’ than ‘twelve baskets full of….’
kophinos (8.19) ‘basket’: a stiff wicker basket in which the Jews carried provisions. There is no agreement as to the precise size, nor does it seem that difference in size is what distinguished it from the spuris ‘basket’ of 8.8. It appears that spuris was a flexible mat-basket, made of rushes, perhaps, especially used by fishermen for carrying fish or food generally.
kai apo tōn ichthuōn ‘and of the fish,’ i.e. ‘and some of the fish’ (Translator’s New Testament): for this same kind of construction cf. 5.35 (cf. Arndt & Gingrich: ‘the remnants of the fish’).
Translation:
They all would evidently refer not only to the people but to the disciples and Jesus. One may translate ‘everyone ate.’
When the receptor language demands an active construction, specifying who took up the fragments, it is probably justifiable to use ‘the disciples took up.’ They did not pick up the food from the ground, and hence one may translate as in some languages ‘received back from the people pieces of bread and fish, enough to fill twelve baskets.’
Though the Greek word for ‘basket’ kophinos does not indicate the specific size of the container involved, it is entirely legitimate to select in the receptor language a term which would identify a relatively large basket, the type of container that might be carried by people who were out gathering supplies in the fields or who used the baskets for transporting produce.
Quoted with permission from Bratcher, Robert G. and Nida, Eugene A. A Handbook on the Gospel of Mark. (UBS Handbook Series). New York: UBS, 1961. For this and other handbooks for translators see here .
It may be natural in some languages to begin a new sentence here. It may also be natural to include a time word. For example:
Then (Good News Bible) -or-
After that -or-
After they were finished eating
the disciples picked up: The Greek verb that the Berean Standard Bible translates as the disciples picked up is literally “they picked up.” There are several ways to interpret the word “they”:
(1) It refers to the disciples. For example, the Contemporary English Version says:
Jesus’ disciples picked up
(Berean Standard Bible, New International Version, Good News Bible, Contemporary English Version, New Century Version)
(2) It refers to the crowd. Looking back to the previous clause (6:24), “they picked up” would grammatically refer to the crowd.
(3) It refers to the disciples and the crowd.
Many English versions translate this literally as “they.” It is not possible to tell which interpretation they follow. You may also translate this in a similar way, unless your readers will understand that only the crowd picked up the food. If your readers will understand that the disciples did not participate, then you should follow interpretation (1) and explicitly say “the disciples.”
picked up: The Greek word that the Berean Standard Bible translates as picked up means to lift up and carry away. In this context it probably indicates that the disciples gathered or collected pieces of uneaten food from the crowd. They probably did not pick up crumbs from the ground.
Here are some other ways to translate this:
They collected (New Jerusalem Bible) -or-
They filled
twelve basketfuls: The amount of food that the disciples collected was enough to fill twelve baskets. We do not know what kind of baskets they used. They might have been small, wicker baskets normally used by travelers or larger baskets used to carry produce to and from the marketplace. (BAGD (page 563) and Louw & Nida (page 71) define kophinos as a large basket for carrying food and produce. This view is followed by France (page 268), Swete (page 135) and Taylor (page 325). But Lenski (page 269), Hiebert (page 162) and Lane (page 231) take this basket to refer to a small wicker basket normally used by Jewish laborers and travelers to carry their food and other essentials during the day. It seems unlikely that the crowd would have run from the various towns along the lake carrying large produce baskets. If these were large baskets, they may have been in the boat used by Jesus and his disciples.) If possible, use a general word for “basket.”
If you need to use a specific word, use a word that refers to a somewhat smaller or medium-sized basket suitable for carrying food.
of broken pieces of bread and fish: The Greek word that the Berean Standard Bible translates as broken pieces of bread is literally “fragments/pieces.” The Berean Standard Bible has added the information that these were fragments of bread. The fish are mentioned separately in the Greek. They were also broken fragments. The broken pieces probably refer to pieces of bread and fish that the people did not eat when the food was distributed. They were not crumbs or pieces of food that fell from the people’s mouths as they were eating.
The Contemporary English Version has another way to translate this phrase:
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All Scripture quotations in this publication, unless otherwise indicated, are from The Holy Bible, Berean Standard Bible.
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